Version 0.5.0

Information about releases and roadmap.
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tonberrytoby
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Re: Version 0.5.0

Post by tonberrytoby »

So, I generated around 30 maps with the enemies set to rare and all resources set to frequent.
It was impossible to reach all 4 resources from the starting place without fighting through enemy bases on all of the maps. Most of the maps had even rocket turrets.

Could you please add an option to set a minimum distance from the startpoint for enemy bases?
And while you are at it, could there be some sort of fast start option where you start with more gear? Like in the later campaign levels.

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Re: Version 0.5.0

Post by Candunc »

tonberrytoby wrote:So, I generated around 30 maps with the enemies set to rare and all resources set to frequent.
It was impossible to reach all 4 resources from the starting place without fighting through enemy bases on all of the maps. Most of the maps had even rocket turrets.

Could you please add an option to set a minimum distance from the startpoint for enemy bases?
Yes, I noticed this as well. I am between at least 6 bases right now, just keep your distance from them. It seems as the bases get bigger, the more defenses there are scattered about, making actual bases rather than the old 'alien spawnpoint'. It makes it a bit more difficult, but now you have to advance much quicker in order to reach more resources.

Cerus
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Re: Version 0.5.0

Post by Cerus »

Loving the update, only...I can't seem to create a map where the various resources are anywhere near each other, everything is insanely spread out, seemingly no matter what options I choose.

Hi-Torque
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Re: Version 0.5.0

Post by Hi-Torque »

Hello,

I too have been experimenting with various map settings. Like some of the guys above, even the rare setting gives you more enemies than in the previous version.

Also, I have had a difficult time generating a map where all resources were within a screen or two of each other at maximum zoom out. This would be several hundred tiles of belts...I get these maps in any configuration of segment size/frequency etc.

Nevertheless, I am immensely enjoying the new GUI and graphics.

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Re: Version 0.5.0

Post by slpwnd »

Sorry for the complications guys.

I have generated couple of testing maps (like 15 or so). The setting were default and the enemy bases were set to rare or very rare. More than half of them were playable (enemies reasonably far away and all four resources within reach). However a bit of luck is needed.

The map generator has a minimal hardcoded distance for the enemy bases from the player spawning position. At the moment this is set to 100 but it should probably be higher. Also the enemy bases frequency / size increases slightly with the distance form the starting position.

We will soften the settings for enemy base generation for the 0.5.1 bugfix release (larger minimal distance and bit lower frequency). The thing with basic resources being present close to the player starting location has been brought up couple of times already. It is a good point. Running around searching for resources is not much fun. We will add a special small boost to resource appearance probability close to the player spawning location for 0.5.1 for these as well.

SilverWarior
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Re: Version 0.5.0

Post by SilverWarior »

Quick note to those who use more advanced firewal protections in "Interactive mode" where you are being asked to decide to either allow or deny any new detected internet conection.
When I upgraded Factorio to version 0.5.0 today and tried to login through Factorio using my username and password Factorio noted me that login process was unsucsesfull. I noticed that my firewall (Eset Smart Security) hasn't noted me that Factorio even tried to establish internet conection. I gues this is due to the way how Factorio tries to conect to the internet.
Anywhay I hat to manually add Factorio.exe to trusted aplication which can form internet conections for me being able to login within the game and check for updates. After that I had no problems.

Unles you count the fact that Factorio didn't figured out that old scenario pack is already obsolete and should be updated with new one.
Yes I read the instructions in the first post bout the need to manually delete old scenario pack folder but I still gave it a try.

The first thing that cught my mind with this expiriment is that Factorio didn't even ofered me the ability to download new scenario pack until I deleted old one.
The second thing that caught my mind is that when I clicked on od scenario pack entry in mods section inside Factorio it showed that everything is OK even thou there is different version of game core present in Factorio 0.5.0. Why is that? Shouldn't Factorio check to see if base pack is of corect version needed by scenario pack?


Anywhay I'll go and play Factiorio now and post my gameplay insights later on.

Hi-Torque
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Re: Version 0.5.0

Post by Hi-Torque »

Good Evening,

There is certainly no reason to apologize for an experimental alpha. I hope with our input you guys can finish crafting a game we will all enjoy playing for a very long time. I look forward to further updates with great enthusiasm. A bit off topic, but I am so pleased with Factorio, I have been playing it to the exclusion of nearly every single game I own. It has also completely disrupted my hobby of building paper models...An absolute dream of a game!

SilverWarior
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Re: Version 0.5.0

Post by SilverWarior »

slpwnd wrote:The map generator has a minimal hardcoded distance for the enemy bases from the player spawning position. At the moment this is set to 100 but it should probably be higher. Also the enemy bases frequency / size increases slightly with the distance form the starting position.
Why not make this also adjustable like other parameters.
slpwnd wrote:The thing with basic resources being present close to the player starting location has been brought up couple of times already. It is a good point. Running around searching for resources is not much fun. We will add a special small boost to resource appearance probability close to the player spawning location for 0.5.1 for these as well.
I don't know how your map algorithm works but why not trying to make it so that resource fileds which are closer to the spawn points are usually smaller and closer together but the resource fields which are further away are larger and somwheat more spread out between each other.
This will alow easy way to find all of the resources close by but force him to spread out to be able to gather larger quantities of theese resources.

Now without knowing how your map generator algorithm works I can't give you any more detailed information as how to achieve this. But if you are wiling to share that infor with me on PM I would try to help you out with this as best I could.

zlosynus
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Re: Version 0.5.0

Post by zlosynus »

It would be really nice to be able to have custom map generators in lua for example, even if they would be slower. Then nicer levels could be achieved.

ficolas
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Re: Version 0.5.0

Post by ficolas »

As in every update, me asking for the modding changes x)
* Mods can modify the gui style of the game.
How?
Can this be made by the lua script for different GUIs or just in the begining for all the GUIs?
Because it would be awesome to have a smartphone-like frame arround the PDA item, or an electric circuhit as the background for the soldering iron GUI. (Something new coming in some update of the F-Mod)

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Re: Version 0.5.0

Post by ssilk »

zlosynus wrote:It would be really nice to be able to have custom map generators in lua for example, even if they would be slower. Then nicer levels could be achieved.
Maybe this is difficult because the algorithm needs to be deterministic. This means that it can generate any pice of map just by the coordinates and the parameters you have set.

I think the idea of silverwarior is great. I would add, that the areas with less creepers and small but near resources could repeat. For me, that's the points I would like to settle out and begin a second base.
Cool suggestion: Eatable MOUSE-pointers.
Have you used the Advanced Search today?
Need help, question? FAQ - Wiki - Forum help
I still like small signatures...

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Re: Version 0.5.0

Post by slpwnd »

SilverWarior wrote:nles you count the fact that Factorio didn't figured out that old scenario pack is already obsolete and should be updated with new one.
Yes I read the instructions in the first post bout the need to manually delete old scenario pack folder but I still gave it a try.
The updates are basically packages with diffs between different versions. The scenario pack update is a diff from version 0.0.0 (no scenario pack) to 0.5.0. Therefore it doesn't apply in the case when scenario pack (like 0.4.4) is already installed. Sure Factorio could see that 0.4.4 < 0.5.0 and 0.5.0 is a complete package (doesn't need any diff) and simply delete the 0.4.4 version and offer the update. That might be the case in the future (it is not so much work). However we wanted to avoid any complications with the first updater version.
Hi-Torque wrote:There is certainly no reason to apologize for an experimental alpha. I hope with our input you guys can finish crafting a game we will all enjoy playing for a very long time. I look forward to further updates with great enthusiasm. A bit off topic, but I am so pleased with Factorio, I have been playing it to the exclusion of nearly every single game I own.
Thank you. That is very encouraging to hear.
Hi-Torque wrote:It has also completely disrupted my hobby of building paper models...
That is rather pity.
zlosynus wrote:t would be really nice to be able to have custom map generators in lua for example, even if they would be slower. Then nicer levels could be achieved.
This is doable. The map generator can be represented by two functions:

TilePosition -> GeneratedTile
TilePosition -> GeneratedEntities (fish, resources, enemy bases, etc.)

Both of these functions use the deterministic randomness (internal random generator). The issue I see with making a Lua API for this is the performance. It would have to be tested. And of course once we migrate to LuaJIT it coudl be feasible.
ficolas wrote:How?
Can this be made by the lua script for different GUIs or just in the begining for all the GUIs?
Because it would be awesome to have a smartphone-like frame arround the PDA item, or an electric circuhit as the background for the soldering iron GUI. (Something new coming in some update of the F-Mod)
Have a look at the data/core/prototypes/style.lua. These values can be changed from the mod in the same way the regular prototypes for entities, items, recipes, etc. are.
SilverWarior wrote:
slpwnd wrote:The map generator has a minimal hardcoded distance for the enemy bases from the player spawning position. At the moment this is set to 100 but it should probably be higher. Also the enemy bases frequency / size increases slightly with the distance form the starting position.
This is the direction I think we will take. We already have this for the enemy bases (min distance 100).
SilverWarior wrote: Now without knowing how your map generator algorithm works I can't give you any more detailed information as how to achieve this. But if you are wiling to share that infor with me on PM I would try to help you out with this as best I could.
The map generator is based on the Perlin's noise. For an overview it is good to imagine that the generator creates a "mountain range". Afterwards the shape of this mountain range is translated into what is on the map. So for instance if a point on the map is "higher than 3000m" then it will be sand. If it is lower than 3000m but higher than 1000m then it will be grass, etc. There is a lot of manual tweaks to make the maps look reasonable. And yes we are aware that the maps are not of a high quality - it is on the list:)

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Re: Version 0.5.0

Post by zlosynus »

slpwnd wrote:
zlosynus wrote:t would be really nice to be able to have custom map generators in lua for example, even if they would be slower. Then nicer levels could be achieved.
This is doable. The map generator can be represented by two functions:

TilePosition -> GeneratedTile
TilePosition -> GeneratedEntities (fish, resources, enemy bases, etc.)

Both of these functions use the deterministic randomness (internal random generator). The issue I see with making a Lua API for this is the performance. It would have to be tested. And of course once we migrate to LuaJIT it coudl be feasible.
I don't think speed is really an issue, and it should be reasonably fast even in Lua. The thing is that with this one can experiment with maps and stuff like this. And if something is really good, it could be done faster. Also map generator should not be running so much, so it should be fine. (There really are bigger speed concerns than this.)

SilverWarior
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Re: Version 0.5.0

Post by SilverWarior »

slpwnd wrote:The map generator is based on the Perlin's noise. For an overview it is good to imagine that the generator creates a "mountain range". Afterwards the shape of this mountain range is translated into what is on the map. So for instance if a point on the map is "higher than 3000m" then it will be sand. If it is lower than 3000m but higher than 1000m then it will be grass, etc. There is a lot of manual tweaks to make the maps look reasonable. And yes we are aware that the maps are not of a high quality - it is on the list:)
How do you manage to incorporate all map generation parameters into perlin noise. I have read quite some domumentation on perlin noise lately but I can't seem to figure this out.
Now the size of each patch of gound type (sand, grass, mud) could be afected by changing the height range which belongs to each individual patch.
But how do you controll how often do these patches emerge?

Also how do you controll resource placments and creaper base placments?

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Re: Version 0.5.0

Post by kovarex »

The noises we use have 3 basic parameters.
1) Scale
2) Shift
3) Magnitude.

For the purpose of terrain generating, noise for all terrains are generated, every with different settings, and the highest value on the field wins, simple.

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Re: Version 0.5.0

Post by SilverWarior »

Wait you are generating perlin noise for every posible terrain and then compare them between to see which one has higher value at certain location?

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rlerner
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Re: Version 0.5.0

Post by rlerner »

Found a bug.

Have two engines coupled, then, select the rear one (and be in it!), and press "R" or your rotate key.

Hyper warp speed!

Love this, even though I know it's unintentional.

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Re: Version 0.5.0

Post by MF- »

rlerner wrote:Found a bug.

Have two engines coupled, then, select the rear one (and be in it!), and press "R" or your rotate key.

Hyper warp speed!

Love this, even though I know it's unintentional.
Is it compatible with stopping at stations for cargo?

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Re: Version 0.5.0

Post by elgreen »

https://www.factorio.com/download/experimental
The following link is not possible to download

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Re: Version 0.5.0

Post by MF- »

elgreen wrote:https://www.factorio.com/download/experimental
The following link is not possible to download
You need to be logged in. You don't download this link, it's a web page with all the available versions of 0.5.0

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